The Wild's strategy to laugh at the Blues' gamesmanship during this series has really been terrific to watch. I've never seen anything like it at a team level.
I already liked the Wild, but the discipline they're showing makes me really glad that I like them.
All even more fun with respect to the article linked below by Scot.
Yea, the refs could have called interference on Dumba there when he grabs Ott's stick from the bench, I guess. After watching Ott leave his feet on checks 97 times in the last three games (approximate), the refs might be inclined to look the other way.
The Wild have outshot the Blues in the series 78-65. Even in the loss, the Blues only outshot the Wild by 2.
I loved that the Blues kept saying "we need to play like we did in Game 2" after last night.
I feel like if both teams play like Game 2 tomorrow night, the Wild have a pretty solid chance of winning that game.
I completely agree.
I think if either of those pucks that got behind Allen in Game 2 (the dump-in off the stanchion and Coyle's post shot) had crossed the goal line, the Wild were in position to take that game as well. As it stands, I'm content to let them think that level of play will lead to a Blues win.
Wheaton? Seems a strange place for a show of any type.
I know. He plays Turf Club Friday night and Sioux Falls, SD on Sunday. A little out of the way. Maybe he has a friend in Wheaton, BBjr is known to do stuff like that.
Yeah. But so did every venue on that one White Stripes tour, and Bonnie 'Prince' Billy has done some tours that completely avoid big cities.
But Wheaton...
EAR lived in Wheaton until she was 2 or 3.
She was born in Breckenridge.
Alexandria would be a fairly unorthodox stop on the tour of anyone who wasn't specifically from the area (a few larger name CCM artists played the Christian center in the '90s, but that's about it), and Alexandria is a full ten times Wheaton's size, and plus it's on the Interstate.
I have to imagine that he knows someone who lives there, or there's a person who REALLY REALLY like BBjr, and has been stumping hard for a stop.
I was born in Breckenridge as well.
I was waiting for this comment.
I knew that. Or was the hospital in Wahpeton at the time?
The hospital was never in Wahpeton.
In which a grown man insists that another grown man wouldn't have had to throw a potentially lethal object at a person's head if his teammate (another grown man) would just have attempted a takeout slide that may or may not have permanently injured the opposing shortstop.
Yes. It was all Lorenzo Cain's fault.
Because unwritten rules.
The day is early, but that'll be right up there with the dumbest things I'll read today.
football mentality
That is a horrible, braindead, and weirdly self-congratulatory article.
This is the same type of guy who thinks that a scientific analysis of how the game is played in an effort to gain a competitive advantage is a stupid idea.
(Do you like the way I’m making hitting a guy with a baseball sound poetic?)
No, I don't.
I saw the highlights of that Sunday game on TV, and immediately thought of old friend Alex Rios suggesting that players shouldn't be in MLB if they can't control their pitch after his hand was injured on an unintentional hit batsman. Maybe he should tell the rest of his clubhouse that it's even worse when you're intentionally drilling guys.
I remember the good ol' days, when the owners colluded to depress wages (making jobs in the MLB Veblen goods!!!!111one1111!!! I joak! I joak!) and cars didn't have seat belts. Drivers policed each other by ramming each other for not following the unwritten rules of precedence in getting through 4-way stops.
Back in the day, arguments were settled by duels! Like that one time when the sitting Vice President of the United States shot and killed the former Secretary of the Treasury over some slight! Efficient!
back when being veep was worth more than a warm bucket of redacted.
I wonder if Hamilton apologized to Burr for his having shot him. That seems to be the way it works when the Vice President shoots you.
Small sample size
But bigger than you would have imagined!
I can't get over how awesome this response is.
The reason I found and posted this article (aside from badly wanting it to get the FJM treatment) is that I'm not sure if his argument is that far outside the mainstream of baseball thinking. The commissioner of baseball could end this nonsense with a few pretty easy rule changes. It seems anything short of a significant injury to a high profile player or death on the field is not going to be enough to get him to make those changes.
The owners should want this. After all, players are multi-million dollar investments. A dude gets hurt in such a scenario and he still gets paid.
If they're like Arte Moreno, I think they want non-guaranteed contracts instead.
I'm all Go Wild and so forth, but I'll admit to being a little torn:
In 1979, Carter deregulated the American beer industry by making it legal to sell malt, hops, and yeast to American home brewers for the first time since the effective 1920 beginning of Prohibition in the United States. This deregulation led to an increase in home brewing over the 1980s and 1990s that by the 2000s had developed into a strong craft microbrew culture in the United States, with over 2,000 breweries and brewpubs in the United States by 2012.
I have often wondered why the beer industry was stuck on the crappy products for so long and what drove the revolution toward craft beers. Now I know. Raise a glass to our 39th President!
And yet, for some reason, I feel like liquor laws still need revision...
How so?
*ducks*
*waterfowl*
Not only do you want to change beer laws but liquor, too?
What's next, wine laws?
I feel that it is time to eliminate jackbooted controls on distilleries. I want my local [fill in the blank] to be making boutique booze for me.
Good friends here just started distilling cane vodka with plans for whiskey, gin and absinthe. The eldest brother worked for a local distiller of rum, and has had coaching and help setting up the biz, but isn't actually allowed to fire up his massive new column still until the city approves the use of the water. They're going to get everything worked out by greasing the right palms, but hot damn they've had to jump through some pretty awful hoops just to make hooch.
A man could do worse than have that on his record.
This is actually a professional pet peeve of mine -- popular press attributing stuff to presidents that clearly were the work of Congress (home brewing deregulation) or to the states (brewpubs).
Thanks for clearing that up. Now I can go back to thinking that President Carter didn't really accomplish anything.
I'll give him props for a big role in the Camp David Accords.
To be fair, he created the Departments of Education and Energy too, didn't he?
T'was a joke, but Carter sure doesn't have much of a historical legacy (good or bad) compared to his contemporaries.
I blame him for Billy Beer.
I don't think I can legally buy that in MN...
your joak was better than mine.
they were created during his administration, yes. By legislation. I don't know enough about the history of the bills to say what credit should be given to Carter's administration for their drafting and passage.
You can and probably should give more credit to Carter and his people for the creation of FEMA by Executive Order and for an E.O. (12036) designed to reform oversight of the intelligence apparatus, including banning U.S. involvement (direct or indirect) in assassinations.
see above.
I'll be the first to admit my limited awareness of the actual accomplishments and/or pratfalls of most presidents.
pratfalls? no, that was Ford
Who signed the bill? Tip O'Neill?
I am disappointed, bS. Here's what the article you linked to said:
What Carter did sign was HR 1337, which legalized homebrewing "for personal or family use, and not for sale"--'deregulating' individual, not commercial, behavior. The legalization of homebrewing did contribute to the growth of the craft beer industry (according to Charlie Papazian, 90% of the pioneer craft brewers started out making homebrew), so President Carter certainly deserves credit for that...but it just as certainly isn't "beer industry" deregulation.
Hello! That's pretty much what my quote says!
pfft.
Signing a bill just means he hands out pens. Every dollar bill in your wallet is signed by the Treasurer and the Secretary of the Treasury. Are you giving them credit for you having money?
That's exactly the same thing!
?
The bill HR 1337 (short title: "Constructive Sale Price for Excise Tax on Certain Trucks, Buses, Tractors, Et Cetera.") included a Senate committee amendment to allow any household to produce annually untaxed up to 200 gallons each of wine and beer (100 gallons per adult up to 2 adults) and have on hand up to 30 gallons of home-brewed beer at any one time.
The Senate committee report explains that BATF's interpretation of the prior law allowing a "head of any family" to produce up to 200 gallons of wine/year without paying taxes meant it was illegal to homebrew beer.
The committee believes it is appropriate to grant a limited exemption from the beer tax for the production of beer for personal and family use. ... Accordingly, the bill provides a limited exemption from the wine and beer taxes for wine and beer produced, for personal or family use (and not for sale), by adults....
I don't see any mention of the Administration in that language other than a somewhat opaque chastisement of BATF for going after $9/barrel beer taxes from homebrewers.
According to Pete Dunlop's book, Portland Beer: Crafting the Road to Beervana, the legislative efforts trace back to at least 1975, when NY Rep. Barber Conable proposed it. He tried again in 1977 and got the bill out of the House but it died in the Senate. In 1978, California Senator Alan Cranston added the above amendment to the above-mentioned tax bill.
Did we really need Panama? (BTW I grew up there). Ceviche rocks.
CoC, I'm pretty sure you said you went and saw Primus last week. What is their live show like these days? I think a bunch of the jam band fans go to those shows, so I'm curious how "jammy" it is. Also do they play a bunch of older stuff? The last Primus album I heard is close to 20 years old, so I'm curious how much of that stuff they play. I'm faiiiirly certain I'm going to the show (Dinosaur Jr. is opening!) but I'm just kind of curious how much I'll enjoy Primus's set.
It was EPIC, nearly 3 hours of rocking funk jams and fun.
The show was 2 parts:
Primus ( Les, Larry and Herb) opened (no Dinosaur Jr. yet) with older stuff from various albums, mostly singles and stuff fans would know.
Then they were joined by The Fungi Ensemble (bass & percussion) and played their new album in it's entirety, front to back: Primus & the Chocolate Factory with the Fungi Ensemble
Encore was three more songs from their Primus catalogue.
Okay this sounds pretty fun. It's in August and outdoors so I think it'll be a pretty good time, I'll probably go.
Merle Haggard, Kris Kristofferson, and Sturgill are playing a month later at the same place. It's $40 minimum for tickets and I'm only really interested in seeing Sturgill. That one I'm really going to have to think on.
I bought tickets to that trio when they're closing out the MN State Fair - one buddy goes, "Labor Day...I dunno if I wanna spend my holiday doing that." Another said he didn't think he could name one song between the three acts.
sometimes I think I need to purge the old friend list.
I don't know if I want to waste my Merle and Sturge concert-attendance on State Fair performances when I could see them somewhere better.
State Fair & Somewhere Better aren't mutually exclusive.
Red Wings lose game one 1-0 on a walkoff homer on the first pitch of the last inning. Game two coming up.
On the plus side, Alex Meyer had his first good game of the season, and it was really good: six shutout innings, eleven strikeouts, two hits, three walks.
We'll probably still hear how he needs to work on his control since three walks in six innings isn't very good. (nevermind the nearly 4-1 K-BB ratio.)
We'd need some tremendous performances to be able to live up to Big Pelf's showing thus far, obviously.
I give this comment a nine out of ten.
That's why K-BB difference is the better method. Using the ratio makes it too easy to focus on minimizing walks to improve the ratio and makes it look like a 3:1 is the same as 9:3. Of course, the difference method leads to a 9:3 game being the same as a 15:9 game. At that point, I'm kind of curious what sort of game the pitcher had too. I'll just have to watch some Nolan Ryan games.
Early Big Unit. Don't forget to include HBP too
More excellent pitching in game two, as the Red Wings win 2-0. Taylor Rogers strikes out six in six shutout innings on four hits and a walk. Michael Tonkin pitched a scoreless seventh.
Rogers will probably be the next starting pitcher called up. He has a 19-6 K-BB ratio in 19 innings and a 2.37 ERA. He's also left-handed.
OMG Want so hard:
I also need the bS report on the kraut thingy. Because I want one if it works.
Cool!
The kraut is now two weeks into fermentation. Thinking about testing it soon. I've been very pleased with the thingy so far. Main drawback is remembering to check the moat daily/every other day to make sure it has not dried out.
well I bought a big jar here @ cub to tide me over. (for 1.69!!!) But I'll probably pick this up so I can make my own anyway. My wife plants, I'm the only one who consistently remembers to water, so I should be good there.
Pictures when it happens.
for sure.
How did Terrance and Phillip get involved in there?
Pretty bold on the "perfect meal" claims here, folks...I bet I could disprove them.
and this year's Joe Schultz Award goes to Bryan Price!
it's after lunch now, so I feel that I can share this story about the London fatberg.
It was 3 years ago on this date, Philip Humber threw a perfect game while pitching for the White Sox.
He had a 7.39 ERA the rest of that season with a .913 OPS against. He had a 7.90 ERA pitching for Houston in 2013 and hasn't pitched in the majors since. Right now, he's pitching in Korea.
I can't believe no one is mentioning that we are finding the order football teams play each other in match-ups we already know about!!!!!! 1!!!!!!
Heard on the radio this morning that NFL Network would be having a three hour schedule analysis blow out. I don't understand how that is exciting for people. I really, really do not.
On the other hand, if the Wild keep playing like this, we'll only have to pretend to care about what Steve Ott does for two more games.
They looked so good last night.
Yes they did ... and Ott looked so foolish.
I don't know how to post it, but my favorite gif of the evening is this one.
I see wattsy shared it last night.
The Wild's strategy to laugh at the Blues' gamesmanship during this series has really been terrific to watch. I've never seen anything like it at a team level.
I already liked the Wild, but the discipline they're showing makes me really glad that I like them.
All even more fun with respect to the article linked below by Scot.
This article makes it sound like Ott's the victim.
Yea, the refs could have called interference on Dumba there when he grabs Ott's stick from the bench, I guess. After watching Ott leave his feet on checks 97 times in the last three games (approximate), the refs might be inclined to look the other way.
The Wild have outshot the Blues in the series 78-65. Even in the loss, the Blues only outshot the Wild by 2.
I loved that the Blues kept saying "we need to play like we did in Game 2" after last night.
I feel like if both teams play like Game 2 tomorrow night, the Wild have a pretty solid chance of winning that game.
I completely agree.
I think if either of those pucks that got behind Allen in Game 2 (the dump-in off the stanchion and Coyle's post shot) had crossed the goal line, the Wild were in position to take that game as well. As it stands, I'm content to let them think that level of play will lead to a Blues win.
Hey Nibs, this could be fun.
http://www.bandsintown.com/event/9715378?artist=BOBBY+BARE+JR%27S+YOUNG+CRIMINALS+STARVATION+LEAGUE&came_from=217
I'll second the rec'.
Yeah, it could be.
Wheaton? Seems a strange place for a show of any type.
I know. He plays Turf Club Friday night and Sioux Falls, SD on Sunday. A little out of the way. Maybe he has a friend in Wheaton, BBjr is known to do stuff like that.
Yeah. But so did every venue on that one White Stripes tour, and Bonnie 'Prince' Billy has done some tours that completely avoid big cities.
But Wheaton...
EAR lived in Wheaton until she was 2 or 3.
She was born in Breckenridge.
Alexandria would be a fairly unorthodox stop on the tour of anyone who wasn't specifically from the area (a few larger name CCM artists played the Christian center in the '90s, but that's about it), and Alexandria is a full ten times Wheaton's size, and plus it's on the Interstate.
I have to imagine that he knows someone who lives there, or there's a person who REALLY REALLY like BBjr, and has been stumping hard for a stop.
I was born in Breckenridge as well.
I was waiting for this comment.
I knew that. Or was the hospital in Wahpeton at the time?
The hospital was never in Wahpeton.
In which a grown man insists that another grown man wouldn't have had to throw a potentially lethal object at a person's head if his teammate (another grown man) would just have attempted a takeout slide that may or may not have permanently injured the opposing shortstop.
Yes. It was all Lorenzo Cain's fault.
Because unwritten rules.
The day is early, but that'll be right up there with the dumbest things I'll read today.
football mentality
That is a horrible, braindead, and weirdly self-congratulatory article.
This is the same type of guy who thinks that a scientific analysis of how the game is played in an effort to gain a competitive advantage is a stupid idea.
(Do you like the way I’m making hitting a guy with a baseball sound poetic?)
No, I don't.
I saw the highlights of that Sunday game on TV, and immediately thought of old friend Alex Rios suggesting that players shouldn't be in MLB if they can't control their pitch after his hand was injured on an unintentional hit batsman. Maybe he should tell the rest of his clubhouse that it's even worse when you're intentionally drilling guys.
I remember the good ol' days, when the owners colluded to depress wages (making jobs in the MLB Veblen goods!!!!111one1111!!! I joak! I joak!) and cars didn't have seat belts. Drivers policed each other by ramming each other for not following the unwritten rules of precedence in getting through 4-way stops.
Back in the day, arguments were settled by duels! Like that one time when the sitting Vice President of the United States shot and killed the former Secretary of the Treasury over some slight! Efficient!
back when being veep was worth more than a warm bucket of redacted.
I wonder if Hamilton apologized to Burr for his having shot him. That seems to be the way it works when the Vice President shoots you.
Small sample size
But bigger than you would have imagined!
I can't get over how awesome this response is.
The reason I found and posted this article (aside from badly wanting it to get the FJM treatment) is that I'm not sure if his argument is that far outside the mainstream of baseball thinking. The commissioner of baseball could end this nonsense with a few pretty easy rule changes. It seems anything short of a significant injury to a high profile player or death on the field is not going to be enough to get him to make those changes.
The owners should want this. After all, players are multi-million dollar investments. A dude gets hurt in such a scenario and he still gets paid.
If they're like Arte Moreno, I think they want non-guaranteed contracts instead.
I'm all Go Wild and so forth, but I'll admit to being a little torn:
Bernie Federko is everywhere, it seems. Here, anyway
That's nice and all, but maybe this could prevent you from being torn?
I'm not really torn, I'm just tooting the company horn.
Ahhh, I gotcha. I completely did not pick up on that.
maybe this would help you pick up on that.
Its snowed on me for the second day in a row. Its is getting stupid.
Jimmy Carter, making life better for us all.
I have often wondered why the beer industry was stuck on the crappy products for so long and what drove the revolution toward craft beers. Now I know. Raise a glass to our 39th President!
And yet, for some reason, I feel like liquor laws still need revision...
How so?
*ducks*
*waterfowl*
Not only do you want to change beer laws but liquor, too?
What's next, wine laws?
I feel that it is time to eliminate jackbooted controls on distilleries. I want my local [fill in the blank] to be making boutique booze for me.
Good friends here just started distilling cane vodka with plans for whiskey, gin and absinthe. The eldest brother worked for a local distiller of rum, and has had coaching and help setting up the biz, but isn't actually allowed to fire up his massive new column still until the city approves the use of the water. They're going to get everything worked out by greasing the right palms, but hot damn they've had to jump through some pretty awful hoops just to make hooch.
A man could do worse than have that on his record.
No, Carter didn't deregulate the brewing industry.
😉
This is actually a professional pet peeve of mine -- popular press attributing stuff to presidents that clearly were the work of Congress (home brewing deregulation) or to the states (brewpubs).
Thanks for clearing that up. Now I can go back to thinking that President Carter didn't really accomplish anything.
I'll give him props for a big role in the Camp David Accords.
To be fair, he created the Departments of Education and Energy too, didn't he?
T'was a joke, but Carter sure doesn't have much of a historical legacy (good or bad) compared to his contemporaries.
I blame him for Billy Beer.
I don't think I can legally buy that in MN...
your joak was better than mine.
they were created during his administration, yes. By legislation. I don't know enough about the history of the bills to say what credit should be given to Carter's administration for their drafting and passage.
You can and probably should give more credit to Carter and his people for the creation of FEMA by Executive Order and for an E.O. (12036) designed to reform oversight of the intelligence apparatus, including banning U.S. involvement (direct or indirect) in assassinations.
see above.
I'll be the first to admit my limited awareness of the actual accomplishments and/or pratfalls of most presidents.
pratfalls? no, that was Ford
Who signed the bill? Tip O'Neill?
I am disappointed, bS. Here's what the article you linked to said:
Hello! That's pretty much what my quote says!
pfft.
Signing a bill just means he hands out pens. Every dollar bill in your wallet is signed by the Treasurer and the Secretary of the Treasury. Are you giving them credit for you having money?
That's exactly the same thing!
?
The bill HR 1337 (short title: "Constructive Sale Price for Excise Tax on Certain Trucks, Buses, Tractors, Et Cetera.") included a Senate committee amendment to allow any household to produce annually untaxed up to 200 gallons each of wine and beer (100 gallons per adult up to 2 adults) and have on hand up to 30 gallons of home-brewed beer at any one time.
The Senate committee report explains that BATF's interpretation of the prior law allowing a "head of any family" to produce up to 200 gallons of wine/year without paying taxes meant it was illegal to homebrew beer.
I don't see any mention of the Administration in that language other than a somewhat opaque chastisement of BATF for going after $9/barrel beer taxes from homebrewers.
According to Pete Dunlop's book, Portland Beer: Crafting the Road to Beervana, the legislative efforts trace back to at least 1975, when NY Rep. Barber Conable proposed it. He tried again in 1977 and got the bill out of the House but it died in the Senate. In 1978, California Senator Alan Cranston added the above amendment to the above-mentioned tax bill.
this history is actually pretty interesting. From Window on Congress: A Congressional Biography of Barber B. Conable, Jr By James S. Fleming:
Did we really need Panama? (BTW I grew up there). Ceviche rocks.
CoC, I'm pretty sure you said you went and saw Primus last week. What is their live show like these days? I think a bunch of the jam band fans go to those shows, so I'm curious how "jammy" it is. Also do they play a bunch of older stuff? The last Primus album I heard is close to 20 years old, so I'm curious how much of that stuff they play. I'm faiiiirly certain I'm going to the show (Dinosaur Jr. is opening!) but I'm just kind of curious how much I'll enjoy Primus's set.
It was EPIC, nearly 3 hours of rocking funk jams and fun.
The show was 2 parts:
Primus ( Les, Larry and Herb) opened (no Dinosaur Jr. yet) with older stuff from various albums, mostly singles and stuff fans would know.
Then they were joined by The Fungi Ensemble (bass & percussion) and played their new album in it's entirety, front to back: Primus & the Chocolate Factory with the Fungi Ensemble
Encore was three more songs from their Primus catalogue.
[edit] Review of the show here.
Okay this sounds pretty fun. It's in August and outdoors so I think it'll be a pretty good time, I'll probably go.
Merle Haggard, Kris Kristofferson, and Sturgill are playing a month later at the same place. It's $40 minimum for tickets and I'm only really interested in seeing Sturgill. That one I'm really going to have to think on.
I bought tickets to that trio when they're closing out the MN State Fair - one buddy goes, "Labor Day...I dunno if I wanna spend my holiday doing that." Another said he didn't think he could name one song between the three acts.
sometimes I think I need to purge the old friend list.
I don't know if I want to waste my Merle and Sturge concert-attendance on State Fair performances when I could see them somewhere better.
State Fair & Somewhere Better aren't mutually exclusive.
Red Wings lose game one 1-0 on a walkoff homer on the first pitch of the last inning. Game two coming up.
On the plus side, Alex Meyer had his first good game of the season, and it was really good: six shutout innings, eleven strikeouts, two hits, three walks.
We'll probably still hear how he needs to work on his control since three walks in six innings isn't very good. (nevermind the nearly 4-1 K-BB ratio.)
We'd need some tremendous performances to be able to live up to Big Pelf's showing thus far, obviously.
I give this comment a nine out of ten.
That's why K-BB difference is the better method. Using the ratio makes it too easy to focus on minimizing walks to improve the ratio and makes it look like a 3:1 is the same as 9:3. Of course, the difference method leads to a 9:3 game being the same as a 15:9 game. At that point, I'm kind of curious what sort of game the pitcher had too. I'll just have to watch some Nolan Ryan games.
Early Big Unit. Don't forget to include HBP too
More excellent pitching in game two, as the Red Wings win 2-0. Taylor Rogers strikes out six in six shutout innings on four hits and a walk. Michael Tonkin pitched a scoreless seventh.
Rogers will probably be the next starting pitcher called up. He has a 19-6 K-BB ratio in 19 innings and a 2.37 ERA. He's also left-handed.
OMG Want so hard:
I also need the bS report on the kraut thingy. Because I want one if it works.
Cool!
The kraut is now two weeks into fermentation. Thinking about testing it soon. I've been very pleased with the thingy so far. Main drawback is remembering to check the moat daily/every other day to make sure it has not dried out.
well I bought a big jar here @ cub to tide me over. (for 1.69!!!) But I'll probably pick this up so I can make my own anyway. My wife plants, I'm the only one who consistently remembers to water, so I should be good there.
Pictures when it happens.
for sure.
How did Terrance and Phillip get involved in there?
Pretty bold on the "perfect meal" claims here, folks...I bet I could disprove them.
and this year's Joe Schultz Award goes to Bryan Price!
it's after lunch now, so I feel that I can share this story about the London fatberg.
I'm sure I read about that a year or more ago...
Interview with Joe Haldeman at War Is Boring blog.
It was 3 years ago on this date, Philip Humber threw a perfect game while pitching for the White Sox.
He had a 7.39 ERA the rest of that season with a .913 OPS against. He had a 7.90 ERA pitching for Houston in 2013 and hasn't pitched in the majors since. Right now, he's pitching in Korea.
I can't believe no one is mentioning that we are finding the order football teams play each other in match-ups we already know about!!!!!! 1!!!!!!
Heard on the radio this morning that NFL Network would be having a three hour schedule analysis blow out. I don't understand how that is exciting for people. I really, really do not.