Well, they kept the smoke and mirrors going longer than most of us thought they would.
94 thoughts on “August 10, 2015: Losing Record”
PunMan's Game of the Week
Today, I want to highlight another game I played at Gen Con that I really enjoyed. Viticulture is a worker placement game that plays from 2-6 players. The theme is that you are a vineyard owner looking to make the best vineyard possible. I've been interested in this game for a while as I love worker placement games, and the theme is something I can relate to. I might even be able to get my wife into it. The game plays like most other worker placement games, but with a few twists. Each round plays like a year's time. In Spring, you bid for turn order. Going first is nice, but going further back in the turn order can get you other benefits, such as extra cards, extra money, or an extra worker. In Summer, there are actions for giving tours (earning money), planting vines, and building structures (that help make your vineyard more efficient). In Fall, you draw a card that can help give you special benefits. In Winter, you harvest grapes, make wine and fill orders. The game plays until one player earns 20 VP, once that happens, the year finishes and whoever has the most VP wins the game.
There's also an impressive expansion to Viticulture called Tuscany that evolves the game over several plays, similar to that of Risk: Legacy. I did not get a chance to play with Tuscany, though Gen Con did have a Tuscany campaign going on throughout the con.
I mentioned to the other people playing that I wish I had a nice glass of red to go along with the game. This game really hit a sweet spot with me, being worker placement, and having a great theme. Also, it's by a great company called Stonemaier Games, which is quickly gaining a reputation for making solid games with excellent components.
My biggest question with worker-placement games is whether there's legitimately multiple paths to victory or not? It often seems like you're competing for just one or two key slots in these games, and turn order ends up making all the difference (I've had a couple games of Agricola go south recently for this exact reason...)
It probably depends on the game. Sometimes one path does seem to win out though. With Viticulture, I almost forget I'm playing a game, and just enjoy the theme.
Advice needed: There's a company outing to the Twins game on Thursday (yay!). However, the geniuses in another department scheduled me (and several others) to present at a webinar during that time (boo!). I'll be done at 2:00. Should I even consider going over to the game after that?
Well, it will get you out of the rest of the day of work, right?
Check the game conditions before you head over. If the Twins are losing badly, or the game is in the 6th or later, maybe don't bother?
Unless there's a no-hitter going.
I have a better dilemma: the Boss is taking the actuarial team out to the Surly brewery this afternoon.
However... it's not a dilemma.
Stop in and say "Hi". We're right across the street.
Maybe? Will you be there in about an hour? Or closer to 5pm?
OK, next time for sure.
We tried to convince boss this should be a daily thing, if not weekly at a minimum.
The train goes right there!
(First time on the Green Line.)
Yeah, we'll have to try again next time. Sorry I missed those later messages. Phone goes in a drawer at work.
Well I'm taking Aquinas to Thursday's game, so...
Promise me you won't leave before I get there and I'll come by.
Well, I won't leave before the game ends... that work?
Since June 1, the Twins are 25-37, a pace over a full season that would net 97 losses. Last week I said take the under on 79 wins. Anyone not with me on that now?
What the Twins should do is try to trade Torii Hunter (waivers, I get that, I said try) and not just because I don't like him. He's still pretty serviceable at 40 and someone might like having a fourth outfielder, RH power bat. I'm not sure he'll bring much, but with Buxton almost ready to come back, I'd rather see Rosario, Hicks and Buxton get maximum playing time now. Those three guys, with Sano, Dozier, and Ploufferdoodle form the basis for a pretty good club in the future. No way are they making the post-season. Play them now and forget about this year.
I completely agree.
We had a fun ride. Now we can make it fun in a different sort of way. This is 2001. Let's Get To Know 'Em.
I agree. I also have to remind myself of the hope/anticipation I felt during spring training at the prospect of a .500 team.
I was hoping the Twins would take at least two in the Cleveland series. Now though, man. The remaining schedule ends heavy on division teams. The games outside the division are Rangers, Yankees, Orioles, Rays, Astros (twice), and Angels. All at or above .500 with two of them leading their respective divisions.
I'm taking the under.
It would have been a sweep, but the one game that they won required late inning heroics and hitting against a starter who immediately went on the DL with an oblique strain. They aren't as bad as they've shown over the last week, but I think they are pretty much a 90 loss team that got a little lucky.
When that poll was here about final number of wins a few weeks ago, I remember being surprised that no one else was expecting a collapse.
If I did the math right, the WGOM projected the Twins for finishing the final 73 games with a record of 38-35.
A lot of that was me being obstinantely optimistic in a poll to skew results. I didn't actually think they'd win the rest of them.
If we bump you from making socal look pessimistic to with the Pirate, that puts the projection for the Twins at 38*-35.
* It changes from 38.45 to 37.88. That's from changing your projection from 45.5 wins to 33.5 wins.
A lot Very little of that was me being obstinantely optimistic in a poll to skew results. I didn't actually think they'd win the rest of them.
FTFM
It would make perfect sense to trade Hunter. I think there's zero chance the Twins will do it.
yup.
Even if the Twins would consider trading Torii, which they won't, it's highly unlikely they would get enough value back for them to agree to a trade. I think they are just behind in player valuation. I keep hearing how great Torii has been and he's been a replacement-level player all season. The other clubs know this and will respond with equal value. Some team might value him a little more if they just want him to DH, but I still doubt it would be what the Twins would want in return.
i-i is a free agent after the season. A player under 40 who contributes in an area where the Twins are deficient (decent reliever? platoon/backup catcher?) while earning something approximating a moderate salary sounds like the definition of "enough value back."
Expect announcement of an extension any day now.
Yep.
I was referring to what the Twins would deem being enough value back. I'd be fine if they just DFA him.
If the Twins' front office thinks they should be getting something more than a bullpen arm or backup catcher for i-i after the deadline, they probably should be DFA'd themselves.
I feel pretty good about taking the under on that before the season started. I wish the front office would have had the developmental vision to do the same.
Yeah, sounds like he's a real degenerate. I just don't believe that he suddenly became that way when he got to Minnesota. Did nobody at VCU complain or did Minnesota not do proper research and/or not care?
Or, he's a man in power and the complaints get hidden.
Yeah, that's why there wouldn't be complaints. Rayno talked about that in her story about why she didn't originally come forward. Which is another question. Does Minnesota provide an atmosphere that makes it feel like you can't challenge the status quo?
@shipleykid @GophersNow why didn't she write about it when it was happening?
I originally looked at this tweet and thought it was just some anonymous doofus. Nope, it's PA, a well-compensated and well-known doofus.
Wowzers....
Apparently, he didn't read the story because she explains that in it. What a moron.
College sports in general seems to cultivate that type of atmosphere.
Unfortunately I think it's pervasive throughout business. The Girlfriend is attractive and very successful in a sales/consulting business. She's had lots of experience of men showing an "interest" in her career only as a means to get other attention.
Yeah, this, for sure.
Pervasive throughout life, really. I mean, sure, it's more prevalent in some areas than others. But harassment or sexism or whatever we want to call it is bigger than any one circumstance or workplace or industry--it's systemic.
I think it's more "big college athletics" make it seem like you can't challenge the status quo.
Frankly, I'm shocked at how well this seems to be going - no embattled retrenchment effort, resigned as quickly as possible, university appears to legitimately be inquiring into possible other unreported cases, etc.
I think the University knew what they had on their hands and probably thought, finally, we can get rid of his ass. Just a guess.
A scary thought is how far did this guy take it when he came upon a woman who didn't have the strength to initially tell him no as repeatedly as Rayno did?
Also, he brought a woman with him from VCU to be the head of women's athletics. She's now the interim athletic director. This seems like an awfully nice thing for a guy to do who obviously has little regard or respect for women. Was this his way of bribing her to keep her from talking? Was he afraid that once she was no longer under his "control" that she would start talking?
Also, he brought a woman with him from VCU to be the head of women's athletics. She's now the interim athletic director.
Interim A.D. Beth Goetz was from Butler and was hired separately from Morewood Teague.
Hmmm. OK. I thought for sure I read she was from VCU. Can't find it now.
To be fair, a lot more people hold up TBL pretty highly than just WGOM Citizens.
Last Friday MPR aired a feature on the high-tech composite industry in my hometown. Everything from canoes to bows for string instruments to materials for NASA are produced by various companies. My little sister supplied the music for the piece; she works for the bow company as the liaison to their artists (but also has worked in production!). Pretty proud of her.
Very cool CH. Thanks for sharing.
My phone was damaged last night to the point where it is now unuseable. I've had it for over two years and really liked it, so I'm pretty bummed. Anyway, I'm replacing it with a Windows phone, so we'll see how that goes.
I used to have a Windows phone and now I have an Android. I miss the OS, but it's nice to have a device that gets attention from app developers. I'm curious to see how useful the phone/PC integration is with Windows 10.
I've only had it going for a couple hours, but so far I like things. (yay, swype-like technology). I'm already used to, and really like the tiles. Boo to no chrome, though. The lesser dev support isn't as huge a deal for me. I didn't really use a ton of apps on my Android anyway, and I think that support will come as they gain traction.
Good thing we've got replacement level production from ii so we can stash Buxton in the minors.
You don't store your best cigars in the bathroom medicine cabinet.
yeah, I don't know what the hell that means either.
Makes sense. Maybe help Rochester in the wild card (unlikely to do much) and sell some tickets. Then call him up when the season ends.
Hey free, wtf is up with the bike attack in your neighborhood?
Yeah fun stuff. Now instead of just making sure I don't get side swiped by an inattentive driver I have to make sure no one wants to throw cement chunks at me.
Wonder how much Barreiro's incessant "bike terrorist" drum beating contributed to this asshole's decision.
Dan Barreiro seems like a genuinely awful human being. I could be wrong.
Chances are more likely you could be right.
Speaking of... I had a facebook friend in a bad bike accident over the weekend. SUV pulled around him, then immediately made a righthand turn, cutting him off. He had no time to slow down or stop, and got busted up pretty bad, ending up in the hospital.
I had the same happen to me in Minneapolis about 10 years ago, only left-hand turn (bike lanes were in the middle... are they still?). I was able to hit brakes a little bit, and flipped over the trunk of the car with only minor scrapes and bruising.
Be careful out there.
When I was in grad school, I had someone cut me off like that on a commute home. I slammed on the brakes and went over the handlebars. The driver (turning right into UTC in San Diego) did not stop. Oy. Luckily, neither I nor the bike was seriously harmed.
Question for the bird-people around here: Some nests have sprung up around my house (one on a fake shutter and one on a deck beam), and I'm wondering what kind they are. They are white with black wings, head and tails. The best way I can describe them is the look fairly sleek when flying: tails are almost v-shaped, wings are sharp-looking at the ends.
They aren't dive bombing anyone, or anything, but they are depositing a ton of poop on the driveway and I'm hoping they will be gone soon. The babies just started flying, so I think I'm close to being in the clear to where I can spray the house off.
If you look closely does it have a rustish color under the chin? It sounds like an adult barn swallow to me. As they mature the belly will turn from a reddish to a dingy white.
Also, are nests a stick built nest or is it a mud/clay type of a nest?
I'll take a look when I get home, though Googling barn swallow shows the shape I'm thinking of. I know the recently hatched birds had a very rust-ish color to their bellies and the nest is definitely mud/clay type. I also do live next to a barn....
They were entertaining to watch yesterday when about 10 or so of them were flying around at each other. My daughter really enjoyed it.
Barn swallows are among my favorite birds because of their zipping around.
I'll agree to that. I don't want them to leave because of that, but I do want them to leave because of the poop. (its right in front of the garage door.)
If a clutch recently hatched and left the nest, it may be a good time to knock it down. It is getting pretty late in the year to attempt another cycle so you're not likely doing any harm.
I'm with Smalls.
Nests aren't "homes" like they are depicted in books. When the young leave, they're gone.
(At least for waterfowl and songbirds. Owls and Raptors may be different, and of course Owls and Raptors may use the same nest over and over so don't take one down.)
If the swallows are not gone, taking down an occupied nests is violation of federal law.
(Exceptions for introduced species such as House Sparrows, Starlings, Collared Doves, and Pigeons. House Finches are native to California, so they're a protected species everywhere in the U.S.)
you too!? yeesh, what's with this site?
Yeah, what's with all the bird nerds? Baseball nerds, beer nerds, music nerds - these I all understand, but bird nerds?
Sidebar: "Bird Nerd" is fun to say
About 5 years ago I was in your camp. "Birding? Psh," I said. But then I realized I was actually always watching birds, no matter where I went, and it kind of dawned on me that I was that which I had mocked.
I jest all in good fun. Me calling out someone else on their chosen nerdery is the height of the pot calling the kettle black.
Saw a Cooper's Hawk flying around your neighborhood last night.
(Plus: Pigeons, House Sparrows, and Starlings)
I remember when this first hit me. I was at Walmart at midnight for the release of Final Fantasy VIII, and I kept thinking... "There's a bunch of nerds here." Then I realized that I was one of them.
I thought about opening my Gen Con article with, "Boy, there were a LOT of nerds at this thing."
I also did not mean it derisively. I can fully admit that I lack the observational, critical, and deducing skills necessary to be a successful "birder".
Be careful, AMR might call you out - prove to you that you know more about birds than you claim to.
Most of the birds I recognize are because they're mascots of sports teams. I do love seeing all the pheasants we have in this area, though.
"Birding? Psh," I said.
Now you're more "Birding: 'Psh-psh-psh, psh-psh-psh.'"
Barn Swallows build mud cup nests under things (but with something resting on it.
Tree Swallows have less-forked tails (Barns are the only ones that have the deep "swallowtail" in North America), and nest in cavities like bluebird houses. They are very white on the bottom, and from dark gray (juveniles) to metallic green or blue on the back.
Cliff Swallows have square tails and build mud nests that are balls with tunnel-entrances around them. Coloring like Barn Swallows but more pattern.
Sounds like Barns, but maybe Trees.
Off to Surly!
I'm gonna say barn due to the tail, but I need to look closer, I think.
Not off to Surly!......:(
Barn swallows are definitely V-shaped tail, but AMR's right, they prefer hanging nests (but not exclusive - I've seen them in crotch of rafter boards). The coloring you mention doesn't make me think barn swallow right away, though. And they will dive bomb cats, but not people (EDIT: that I've seen).
It's possible the nest on the deck beam is of a different bird. I haven't actually seen what is under there. Its also possible the birds on the shutter are not so black as I have in my head. I should try to get some pictures, and also keep the cat in the house.
We had a non-hanging nest of barn swallows on our apartment building in Mankato.
PunMan's Game of the Week
Today, I want to highlight another game I played at Gen Con that I really enjoyed. Viticulture is a worker placement game that plays from 2-6 players. The theme is that you are a vineyard owner looking to make the best vineyard possible. I've been interested in this game for a while as I love worker placement games, and the theme is something I can relate to. I might even be able to get my wife into it. The game plays like most other worker placement games, but with a few twists. Each round plays like a year's time. In Spring, you bid for turn order. Going first is nice, but going further back in the turn order can get you other benefits, such as extra cards, extra money, or an extra worker. In Summer, there are actions for giving tours (earning money), planting vines, and building structures (that help make your vineyard more efficient). In Fall, you draw a card that can help give you special benefits. In Winter, you harvest grapes, make wine and fill orders. The game plays until one player earns 20 VP, once that happens, the year finishes and whoever has the most VP wins the game.
There's also an impressive expansion to Viticulture called Tuscany that evolves the game over several plays, similar to that of Risk: Legacy. I did not get a chance to play with Tuscany, though Gen Con did have a Tuscany campaign going on throughout the con.
I mentioned to the other people playing that I wish I had a nice glass of red to go along with the game. This game really hit a sweet spot with me, being worker placement, and having a great theme. Also, it's by a great company called Stonemaier Games, which is quickly gaining a reputation for making solid games with excellent components.
My biggest question with worker-placement games is whether there's legitimately multiple paths to victory or not? It often seems like you're competing for just one or two key slots in these games, and turn order ends up making all the difference (I've had a couple games of Agricola go south recently for this exact reason...)
It probably depends on the game. Sometimes one path does seem to win out though. With Viticulture, I almost forget I'm playing a game, and just enjoy the theme.
Advice needed: There's a company outing to the Twins game on Thursday (yay!). However, the geniuses in another department scheduled me (and several others) to present at a webinar during that time (boo!). I'll be done at 2:00. Should I even consider going over to the game after that?
Well, it will get you out of the rest of the day of work, right?
Check the game conditions before you head over. If the Twins are losing badly, or the game is in the 6th or later, maybe don't bother?
Unless there's a no-hitter going.
I have a better dilemma: the Boss is taking the actuarial team out to the Surly brewery this afternoon.
However... it's not a dilemma.
Stop in and say "Hi". We're right across the street.
Maybe? Will you be there in about an hour? Or closer to 5pm?
OK, next time for sure.
We tried to convince boss this should be a daily thing, if not weekly at a minimum.
The train goes right there!
(First time on the Green Line.)
Yeah, we'll have to try again next time. Sorry I missed those later messages. Phone goes in a drawer at work.
Well I'm taking Aquinas to Thursday's game, so...
Promise me you won't leave before I get there and I'll come by.
Well, I won't leave before the game ends... that work?
Since June 1, the Twins are 25-37, a pace over a full season that would net 97 losses. Last week I said take the under on 79 wins. Anyone not with me on that now?
What the Twins should do is try to trade Torii Hunter (waivers, I get that, I said try) and not just because I don't like him. He's still pretty serviceable at 40 and someone might like having a fourth outfielder, RH power bat. I'm not sure he'll bring much, but with Buxton almost ready to come back, I'd rather see Rosario, Hicks and Buxton get maximum playing time now. Those three guys, with Sano, Dozier, and Ploufferdoodle form the basis for a pretty good club in the future. No way are they making the post-season. Play them now and forget about this year.
I completely agree.
We had a fun ride. Now we can make it fun in a different sort of way. This is 2001. Let's Get To Know 'Em.
I agree. I also have to remind myself of the hope/anticipation I felt during spring training at the prospect of a .500 team.
I was hoping the Twins would take at least two in the Cleveland series. Now though, man. The remaining schedule ends heavy on division teams. The games outside the division are Rangers, Yankees, Orioles, Rays, Astros (twice), and Angels. All at or above .500 with two of them leading their respective divisions.
I'm taking the under.
It would have been a sweep, but the one game that they won required late inning heroics and hitting against a starter who immediately went on the DL with an oblique strain. They aren't as bad as they've shown over the last week, but I think they are pretty much a 90 loss team that got a little lucky.
When that poll was here about final number of wins a few weeks ago, I remember being surprised that no one else was expecting a collapse.
If I did the math right, the WGOM projected the Twins for finishing the final 73 games with a record of 38-35.
A lot of that was me being obstinantely optimistic in a poll to skew results. I didn't actually think they'd win the rest of them.
If we bump you from making socal look pessimistic to with the Pirate, that puts the projection for the Twins at 38*-35.
* It changes from 38.45 to 37.88. That's from changing your projection from 45.5 wins to 33.5 wins.
FTFM
It would make perfect sense to trade Hunter. I think there's zero chance the Twins will do it.
yup.
Even if the Twins would consider trading Torii, which they won't, it's highly unlikely they would get enough value back for them to agree to a trade. I think they are just behind in player valuation. I keep hearing how great Torii has been and he's been a replacement-level player all season. The other clubs know this and will respond with equal value. Some team might value him a little more if they just want him to DH, but I still doubt it would be what the Twins would want in return.
i-i is a free agent after the season. A player under 40 who contributes in an area where the Twins are deficient (decent reliever? platoon/backup catcher?) while earning something approximating a moderate salary sounds like the definition of "enough value back."
Expect announcement of an extension any day now.
Yep.
I was referring to what the Twins would deem being enough value back. I'd be fine if they just DFA him.
If the Twins' front office thinks they should be getting something more than a bullpen arm or backup catcher for i-i after the deadline, they probably should be DFA'd themselves.
I feel pretty good about taking the under on that before the season started. I wish the front office would have had the developmental vision to do the same.
Amelia Rayno exposes Norwood Teague for what he is: a predator. It wasn't too much to drink, it was a pattern of behavior. Drunk texting, my ass.
Yeah, sounds like he's a real degenerate. I just don't believe that he suddenly became that way when he got to Minnesota. Did nobody at VCU complain or did Minnesota not do proper research and/or not care?
Or, he's a man in power and the complaints get hidden.
Yeah, that's why there wouldn't be complaints. Rayno talked about that in her story about why she didn't originally come forward. Which is another question. Does Minnesota provide an atmosphere that makes it feel like you can't challenge the status quo?
I originally looked at this tweet and thought it was just some anonymous doofus. Nope, it's PA, a well-compensated and well-known doofus.
Wowzers....
Apparently, he didn't read the story because she explains that in it. What a moron.
College sports in general seems to cultivate that type of atmosphere.
Unfortunately I think it's pervasive throughout business. The Girlfriend is attractive and very successful in a sales/consulting business. She's had lots of experience of men showing an "interest" in her career only as a means to get other attention.
Yeah, this, for sure.
Pervasive throughout life, really. I mean, sure, it's more prevalent in some areas than others. But harassment or sexism or whatever we want to call it is bigger than any one circumstance or workplace or industry--it's systemic.
I think it's more "big college athletics" make it seem like you can't challenge the status quo.
Frankly, I'm shocked at how well this seems to be going - no embattled retrenchment effort, resigned as quickly as possible, university appears to legitimately be inquiring into possible other unreported cases, etc.
I think the University knew what they had on their hands and probably thought, finally, we can get rid of his ass. Just a guess.
A scary thought is how far did this guy take it when he came upon a woman who didn't have the strength to initially tell him no as repeatedly as Rayno did?
Also, he brought a woman with him from VCU to be the head of women's athletics. She's now the interim athletic director. This seems like an awfully nice thing for a guy to do who obviously has little regard or respect for women. Was this his way of bribing her to keep her from talking? Was he afraid that once she was no longer under his "control" that she would start talking?
Also, he brought a woman with him from VCU to be the head of women's athletics. She's now the interim athletic director.
Interim A.D. Beth Goetz was from Butler and was hired separately from Morewood Teague.
Hmmm. OK. I thought for sure I read she was from VCU. Can't find it now.
Beth Goetz background.
http://www.gophersports.com/genrel/beth_goetz_843785.html
.
oooh, well done.
Someone in the Angels organization is a long-time reader of the WGOM.
To be fair, a lot more people hold up TBL pretty highly than just WGOM Citizens.
Last Friday MPR aired a feature on the high-tech composite industry in my hometown. Everything from canoes to bows for string instruments to materials for NASA are produced by various companies. My little sister supplied the music for the piece; she works for the bow company as the liaison to their artists (but also has worked in production!). Pretty proud of her.
Very cool CH. Thanks for sharing.
My phone was damaged last night to the point where it is now unuseable. I've had it for over two years and really liked it, so I'm pretty bummed. Anyway, I'm replacing it with a Windows phone, so we'll see how that goes.
I used to have a Windows phone and now I have an Android. I miss the OS, but it's nice to have a device that gets attention from app developers. I'm curious to see how useful the phone/PC integration is with Windows 10.
I've only had it going for a couple hours, but so far I like things. (yay, swype-like technology). I'm already used to, and really like the tiles. Boo to no chrome, though. The lesser dev support isn't as huge a deal for me. I didn't really use a ton of apps on my Android anyway, and I think that support will come as they gain traction.
Buxton off the DL!
And optioned to AAA.
Good thing we've got replacement level production from ii so we can stash Buxton in the minors.
You don't store your best cigars in the bathroom medicine cabinet.
yeah, I don't know what the hell that means either.
Makes sense. Maybe help Rochester in the wild card (unlikely to do much) and sell some tickets. Then call him up when the season ends.
Hey free, wtf is up with the bike attack in your neighborhood?
Yeah fun stuff. Now instead of just making sure I don't get side swiped by an inattentive driver I have to make sure no one wants to throw cement chunks at me.
Wonder how much Barreiro's incessant "bike terrorist" drum beating contributed to this asshole's decision.
Dan Barreiro seems like a genuinely awful human being. I could be wrong.
Chances are more likely you could be right.
Speaking of... I had a facebook friend in a bad bike accident over the weekend. SUV pulled around him, then immediately made a righthand turn, cutting him off. He had no time to slow down or stop, and got busted up pretty bad, ending up in the hospital.
I had the same happen to me in Minneapolis about 10 years ago, only left-hand turn (bike lanes were in the middle... are they still?). I was able to hit brakes a little bit, and flipped over the trunk of the car with only minor scrapes and bruising.
Be careful out there.
When I was in grad school, I had someone cut me off like that on a commute home. I slammed on the brakes and went over the handlebars. The driver (turning right into UTC in San Diego) did not stop. Oy. Luckily, neither I nor the bike was seriously harmed.
Question for the bird-people around here: Some nests have sprung up around my house (one on a fake shutter and one on a deck beam), and I'm wondering what kind they are. They are white with black wings, head and tails. The best way I can describe them is the look fairly sleek when flying: tails are almost v-shaped, wings are sharp-looking at the ends.
They aren't dive bombing anyone, or anything, but they are depositing a ton of poop on the driveway and I'm hoping they will be gone soon. The babies just started flying, so I think I'm close to being in the clear to where I can spray the house off.
If you look closely does it have a rustish color under the chin? It sounds like an adult barn swallow to me. As they mature the belly will turn from a reddish to a dingy white.
Also, are nests a stick built nest or is it a mud/clay type of a nest?
I'll take a look when I get home, though Googling barn swallow shows the shape I'm thinking of. I know the recently hatched birds had a very rust-ish color to their bellies and the nest is definitely mud/clay type. I also do live next to a barn....
They were entertaining to watch yesterday when about 10 or so of them were flying around at each other. My daughter really enjoyed it.
Barn swallows are among my favorite birds because of their zipping around.
I'll agree to that. I don't want them to leave because of that, but I do want them to leave because of the poop. (its right in front of the garage door.)
If a clutch recently hatched and left the nest, it may be a good time to knock it down. It is getting pretty late in the year to attempt another cycle so you're not likely doing any harm.
I'm with Smalls.
Nests aren't "homes" like they are depicted in books. When the young leave, they're gone.
(At least for waterfowl and songbirds. Owls and Raptors may be different, and of course Owls and Raptors may use the same nest over and over so don't take one down.)
If the swallows are not gone, taking down an occupied nests is violation of federal law.
(Exceptions for introduced species such as House Sparrows, Starlings, Collared Doves, and Pigeons. House Finches are native to California, so they're a protected species everywhere in the U.S.)
you too!? yeesh, what's with this site?
Yeah, what's with all the bird nerds? Baseball nerds, beer nerds, music nerds - these I all understand, but bird nerds?
Sidebar: "Bird Nerd" is fun to say
About 5 years ago I was in your camp. "Birding? Psh," I said. But then I realized I was actually always watching birds, no matter where I went, and it kind of dawned on me that I was that which I had mocked.
I jest all in good fun. Me calling out someone else on their chosen nerdery is the height of the pot calling the kettle black.
Saw a Cooper's Hawk flying around your neighborhood last night.
(Plus: Pigeons, House Sparrows, and Starlings)
I remember when this first hit me. I was at Walmart at midnight for the release of Final Fantasy VIII, and I kept thinking... "There's a bunch of nerds here." Then I realized that I was one of them.
I thought about opening my Gen Con article with, "Boy, there were a LOT of nerds at this thing."
I also did not mean it derisively. I can fully admit that I lack the observational, critical, and deducing skills necessary to be a successful "birder".
Be careful, AMR might call you out - prove to you that you know more about birds than you claim to.
Most of the birds I recognize are because they're mascots of sports teams. I do love seeing all the pheasants we have in this area, though.
"Birding? Psh," I said.
Now you're more "Birding: 'Psh-psh-psh, psh-psh-psh.'"
I enjoy calling cardinals this way
Barn Swallows build mud cup nests under things (but with something resting on it.
Tree Swallows have less-forked tails (Barns are the only ones that have the deep "swallowtail" in North America), and nest in cavities like bluebird houses. They are very white on the bottom, and from dark gray (juveniles) to metallic green or blue on the back.
Cliff Swallows have square tails and build mud nests that are balls with tunnel-entrances around them. Coloring like Barn Swallows but more pattern.
Sounds like Barns, but maybe Trees.
Off to Surly!
I'm gonna say barn due to the tail, but I need to look closer, I think.
Not off to Surly!......:(
Barn swallows are definitely V-shaped tail, but AMR's right, they prefer hanging nests (but not exclusive - I've seen them in crotch of rafter boards). The coloring you mention doesn't make me think barn swallow right away, though. And they will dive bomb cats, but not people (EDIT: that I've seen).
It's possible the nest on the deck beam is of a different bird. I haven't actually seen what is under there. Its also possible the birds on the shutter are not so black as I have in my head. I should try to get some pictures, and also keep the cat in the house.
We had a non-hanging nest of barn swallows on our apartment building in Mankato.