An issue I have witnessed first hand. Not enough is being done to address it. And a mention of Spamtown!
Absolutely an issue. I could go on and on about this. I may later..
Thanks for posting this. I will probably share it on the book too.
I'd love to hear your thoughts on it. I was definitely the "conscientious girl" type of student described in the article, but now I have two boys, so I'm not sure how much my experience with be helpful as they navigate school.
I think not letting them get too discouraged by the 'shortcomings' listed in the article. If they're all pointed out (as I tend to do to mine) it would be no wonder boys get a bad attitude about school in general.
It is getting better, but the author is spot on that so much of school is a reward system simply for assignment completion. Grades more often reflect those habits rather than, you know, what a student has learned. I was the kind of student who could not complete all the work and still do well on the tests and I got pretty good grades with that system - but if high school me was in high school in 2014 I might have trouble passing.
And, as a special education teacher, I see way too many boys referred for the behaviors mentioned in the article. Almost like being male is a disability in school. The solution to this, of course, is to have adults follow you around and nag you until you get your work in, which interestingly enough further turns these guys off to school or, worse, creates dependence.
I was the kind of student who could not complete all the work and still do well on the tests and I got pretty good grades with that system
That was me. I was the king of doing just enough to get the A. At least three times I got exactly 90% in a class. Meanwhile, kids working twice as hard as me were struggling to pass because they got overwhelmed with tests. My work habits improved in college; I think part of that was having professors who were great at making me interested in learning.
I have noticed a big discrepancy in the way teachers talk about my kids. I think they focus so much on behavior that they miss the kids' strengths.
For example, my son can't sit still, especially in winter when he doesn't get outside enough. His teacher gave him a "below standards" for knowing his math facts in second grade. He was doing three-digit math in his head! I got him on Khan Academy doing third grade math one Saturday morning. He never sat still but he worked on it for three straight hours and was able to do it without help. His standing up and walking around while he figures things out msy drive adults nuts but it really has nothing to do with his learning.
That's you son's learning style. He probably needs to move for optimum learning. He just is not allowed to learn that way in school.
Yes. My daughter was similar at that age.
I remember doing a church thing with a few other families once. One of the parents would do a reading and then the kids would discuss. My daughter would be fidgeting and moving all over the place. I interpreted it as not paying attention but it quickly became apparent that she was absorbing more than the other kids that were sitting nicely. I learned that I had a problem with her moving around but she didn't.
My wife recognizes kids like these. She calls them kinectic learners. I think she does a better job than most of trying to make concessions for them. The problem is that in a classroom setting is these kids can distract others. Also, classroom sizes are getting bigger and bigger as states cut back on education budgets, so it makes it more difficult for teachers to make adjustments for individual learning styles. The kids that can sit still and be quiet and still learn are rewarded because they are easier to manage.
boys tend to be less conscientious than girls—more apt to space out and leave a completed assignment at home, more likely to fail to turn the page and complete the questions on the back
Yowzers. This story apepars to have been observing my eight-year old...or I need to start cutting him some more slack. He'd probably appreciate that.
Incidentally, sometime after college it began to sink in that I did really well in school largely because I was really well-suited for school in strengths and temperamant ('female' brain or some such [fingerprint!])- and that I shouldn't laud those successes as much more than good-fortune.
I was always praised for being the quiet kid. I understand quiet kids are easier to manage but it wasn't really a strength, it was a weakness. I have since outgrown my shyness but it really bothers me to see teachers come down so hard on my daughter's social side.
As a social worker, the quiet clients are less stressful, but it's much harder to help them because it's hard to know what they're thinking, what they're struggling with. I really try to reinforce when clients are honest with me, even if it's negative or frustration with me, as I can't help them much at all otherwise.
the funny thing to me is that the stereotypes in the story are almost exactly flipped in my kids: the Boy (first-born) was a pleaser in elementary and jr high (and into h.s.). Work was always on time, he was pretty well organized, he was teacher-pet-ish in his behavior. The Girl procrastinates, doesn't get the busy work done on time (or care about it other than the impact on grades), and is incredibly competitive about exams. She hates the process of public school (our public school, anyway) Because Bored. Homeworks for her almost always are busy work because she's already internalized the information, and she hates hates hates busy work.
I'd long suspected something like this, but I didn't think it was a global issue. I think the article does a good job of keeping it from being an either/or discussion- just because girls are getting better grades doesn't mean that boys can't, too.
I guess I think teaching should be about getting kids to use a repeatable process to produce the correct results. The problem is many teachers only want to use one process, and have no flexibility for different learning styles.
there is a lot going on in the piece.
formalized schooling is part socialization/inculturization, part 3Rs imparting of knowledge, part problem solving. All three are important for success as an adult. Obviously, problem-solving is a lot more important for creative work, whereas the other parts are important for being a successful cog in a machine. Most of us are more cogs than creators.
Agree completely. The ideal would be covering all of those aspects. I don't see that balance now. I see too much of bright kids (potential creators) saying "school is just not for me" and giving up, generally finding worse things to do with their time.
I really like the idea of two separate grades mentioned in the article. There obviously is value to teaching the skills to organize, meet deadlines, and sit still when moving is not appropriate - it's just happening at the expense of other areas that are important.
But the cog jobs are going away faster than the creative ones.
This article fits the academic performance of my 15 year old son, and 13 year old daughter perfectly. Luckily, for my son, he is off-the-charts smart, and was quickly identified as such. Our local school system and its teachers, did a great job challenging him on a different track within his classrooms. They all realized he could not sit still through lessons that would not challenge him, and found other ways to keep him challenged (and occupied) so he was not disruptive to the rest of the class. Unfortunately, there are other boys in his class who are not given the same latitude and are quickly labeled as troublemakers or underachievers. My daughter is pretty darn smart as well, but possesses the organizational skills mentioned in the article as has a much easier time securing A grades than my son. Very interesting article. Thanks for sharing!
I was one of those that did well in class, did well with tests, did homework early, and was barely challenged by classes, but I was a voracious reader and used all my spare time to read. Reading became programming as college came around.
Runner daughter was also a reader, and did well with here schoolwork.
So Josh Harding has been suspended for injuring his foot off ice. This saved the Wild money so they could sign Kuemper. Writers are falling over themselves saying how sad this is for Harding. He's got MS and all that.
He kicked a wall with his foot while arguing with a teammate. I don't feel too sorry for him.
I agree with you. I root hard for Josh, with all he has been through, but he really made things tough for the Wild by hurting himself in this silliness.
Look at ESPN boosting some baseball by airing a Friday night game between KC and Detroit on ESPN2
Comment of the day, on the NPR piece on The Oatmeal and Japanese honeybees' adaptive defense against giant killer hornets:
Bees are absolutely astounding. Such exceptional creatures-- every interesting adaptation nature could think of has been applied to this extraordinary animal.
- non-verbal communication via standardized dance moves
- Command and Conquer economies based on allergy-inducing pollen
- sexual dimorphism that has females doing all the work forever
- reproductive organs adapted into ferociously painful defensive weapons
- unconscious division of labor with chemically-enhanced nurseries
- the only true dependency for meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeead
- occupying an ecological niche that nearly makes them a keystone species for agriculture itself
It's a wonder we haven't built them a monument yet.
Sigh....
Utah represent!
A couple of years back on Fresh Air, Terry Gross interviewed E.O. Wilson on his lifelong study of ants.
Arrrr, thar be a Nor'easter blowin' here, but she still be better'n bein' home.
Happy holiday!
http://m.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2014/09/why-girls-get-better-grades-than-boys-do/380318/
An issue I have witnessed first hand. Not enough is being done to address it. And a mention of Spamtown!
Absolutely an issue. I could go on and on about this. I may later..
Thanks for posting this. I will probably share it on the book too.
I'd love to hear your thoughts on it. I was definitely the "conscientious girl" type of student described in the article, but now I have two boys, so I'm not sure how much my experience with be helpful as they navigate school.
I think not letting them get too discouraged by the 'shortcomings' listed in the article. If they're all pointed out (as I tend to do to mine) it would be no wonder boys get a bad attitude about school in general.
It is getting better, but the author is spot on that so much of school is a reward system simply for assignment completion. Grades more often reflect those habits rather than, you know, what a student has learned. I was the kind of student who could not complete all the work and still do well on the tests and I got pretty good grades with that system - but if high school me was in high school in 2014 I might have trouble passing.
And, as a special education teacher, I see way too many boys referred for the behaviors mentioned in the article. Almost like being male is a disability in school. The solution to this, of course, is to have adults follow you around and nag you until you get your work in, which interestingly enough further turns these guys off to school or, worse, creates dependence.
I was the kind of student who could not complete all the work and still do well on the tests and I got pretty good grades with that system
That was me. I was the king of doing just enough to get the A. At least three times I got exactly 90% in a class. Meanwhile, kids working twice as hard as me were struggling to pass because they got overwhelmed with tests. My work habits improved in college; I think part of that was having professors who were great at making me interested in learning.
I have noticed a big discrepancy in the way teachers talk about my kids. I think they focus so much on behavior that they miss the kids' strengths.
For example, my son can't sit still, especially in winter when he doesn't get outside enough. His teacher gave him a "below standards" for knowing his math facts in second grade. He was doing three-digit math in his head! I got him on Khan Academy doing third grade math one Saturday morning. He never sat still but he worked on it for three straight hours and was able to do it without help. His standing up and walking around while he figures things out msy drive adults nuts but it really has nothing to do with his learning.
That's you son's learning style. He probably needs to move for optimum learning. He just is not allowed to learn that way in school.
Yes. My daughter was similar at that age.
I remember doing a church thing with a few other families once. One of the parents would do a reading and then the kids would discuss. My daughter would be fidgeting and moving all over the place. I interpreted it as not paying attention but it quickly became apparent that she was absorbing more than the other kids that were sitting nicely. I learned that I had a problem with her moving around but she didn't.
My wife recognizes kids like these. She calls them kinectic learners. I think she does a better job than most of trying to make concessions for them. The problem is that in a classroom setting is these kids can distract others. Also, classroom sizes are getting bigger and bigger as states cut back on education budgets, so it makes it more difficult for teachers to make adjustments for individual learning styles. The kids that can sit still and be quiet and still learn are rewarded because they are easier to manage.
boys tend to be less conscientious than girls—more apt to space out and leave a completed assignment at home, more likely to fail to turn the page and complete the questions on the back
Yowzers. This story apepars to have been observing my eight-year old...or I need to start cutting him some more slack. He'd probably appreciate that.
Incidentally, sometime after college it began to sink in that I did really well in school largely because I was really well-suited for school in strengths and temperamant ('female' brain or some such [fingerprint!])- and that I shouldn't laud those successes as much more than good-fortune.
I was always praised for being the quiet kid. I understand quiet kids are easier to manage but it wasn't really a strength, it was a weakness. I have since outgrown my shyness but it really bothers me to see teachers come down so hard on my daughter's social side.
As a social worker, the quiet clients are less stressful, but it's much harder to help them because it's hard to know what they're thinking, what they're struggling with. I really try to reinforce when clients are honest with me, even if it's negative or frustration with me, as I can't help them much at all otherwise.
the funny thing to me is that the stereotypes in the story are almost exactly flipped in my kids: the Boy (first-born) was a pleaser in elementary and jr high (and into h.s.). Work was always on time, he was pretty well organized, he was teacher-pet-ish in his behavior. The Girl procrastinates, doesn't get the busy work done on time (or care about it other than the impact on grades), and is incredibly competitive about exams. She hates the process of public school (our public school, anyway) Because Bored. Homeworks for her almost always are busy work because she's already internalized the information, and she hates hates hates busy work.
I'd long suspected something like this, but I didn't think it was a global issue. I think the article does a good job of keeping it from being an either/or discussion- just because girls are getting better grades doesn't mean that boys can't, too.
I guess I think teaching should be about getting kids to use a repeatable process to produce the correct results. The problem is many teachers only want to use one process, and have no flexibility for different learning styles.
there is a lot going on in the piece.
formalized schooling is part socialization/inculturization, part 3Rs imparting of knowledge, part problem solving. All three are important for success as an adult. Obviously, problem-solving is a lot more important for creative work, whereas the other parts are important for being a successful cog in a machine. Most of us are more cogs than creators.
Agree completely. The ideal would be covering all of those aspects. I don't see that balance now. I see too much of bright kids (potential creators) saying "school is just not for me" and giving up, generally finding worse things to do with their time.
I really like the idea of two separate grades mentioned in the article. There obviously is value to teaching the skills to organize, meet deadlines, and sit still when moving is not appropriate - it's just happening at the expense of other areas that are important.
But the cog jobs are going away faster than the creative ones.
This article fits the academic performance of my 15 year old son, and 13 year old daughter perfectly. Luckily, for my son, he is off-the-charts smart, and was quickly identified as such. Our local school system and its teachers, did a great job challenging him on a different track within his classrooms. They all realized he could not sit still through lessons that would not challenge him, and found other ways to keep him challenged (and occupied) so he was not disruptive to the rest of the class. Unfortunately, there are other boys in his class who are not given the same latitude and are quickly labeled as troublemakers or underachievers. My daughter is pretty darn smart as well, but possesses the organizational skills mentioned in the article as has a much easier time securing A grades than my son. Very interesting article. Thanks for sharing!
I was one of those that did well in class, did well with tests, did homework early, and was barely challenged by classes, but I was a voracious reader and used all my spare time to read. Reading became programming as college came around.
Runner daughter was also a reader, and did well with here schoolwork.
So Josh Harding has been suspended for injuring his foot off ice. This saved the Wild money so they could sign Kuemper. Writers are falling over themselves saying how sad this is for Harding. He's got MS and all that.
He kicked a wall with his foot while arguing with a teammate. I don't feel too sorry for him.
I agree with you. I root hard for Josh, with all he has been through, but he really made things tough for the Wild by hurting himself in this silliness.
Look at ESPN boosting some baseball by airing a Friday night game between KC and Detroit on ESPN2
Comment of the day, on the NPR piece on The Oatmeal and Japanese honeybees' adaptive defense against giant killer hornets:
Sigh....
Utah represent!
A couple of years back on Fresh Air, Terry Gross interviewed E.O. Wilson on his lifelong study of ants.
Cool interview, but I loved the ending.
T. G.: So who do you like better, people or ants?
EOW: (pregnant pause) People. Then ants.